The White Lotus Star Sam Nivola on That Shocking Incestuous Scene & What Happens to Lochlan

Major spoilers for the sixth episode of The White Lotus season three, “Denials,” below.

If The White Lotus has taught viewers anything over the course of its three seasons, it’s that no one—especially the seemingly innocent—leaves the resort without experiencing some sort of life-altering event. For Lochlan Ratliff, the awkward high school senior played by Sam Nivola, that moment, uh, came during last night’s episode when it was revealed that he and his red-pilled finance bro brother Saxon (Patrick Schwarzenegger) didn’t just kiss during the Full Moon Party as seen in the previous episode—they’d gone far beyond first base. Even for series creator Mike White, who never shies away from taboo subjects, the incestuous plot twist was next-level.

“I totally didn't feel it coming,” Nivola tells W via a phone call from North Carolina, where he’s filming his next project. Upon reflection, though, the 21-year-old actor sees the shocking moment as a fitting metaphor for the toxic dynamics at the heart of the Ratliff family.

To fully embody their roles, the cast—including patriarch Timothy (Jason Isaacs), delusional mother Victoria (Parker Posey), and Piper (Sarah Catherine Hook), the daughter whose fascination with Buddhism prompted the Ratliff vacation in the first place—formed a deep bond over their seven-month production in Thailand. “I learn so much on every shoot. It’s almost too much to put into words,” says Nivola, who also explored complicated family dynamics in Netflix’s The Perfect Couple. “You can do as much preparation by yourself as you want, but when you get in the room, it's about your relationship with the other actors and what they're bringing to the table.” Below, the rising star, who happens to be the son of actors Emily Mortimer and Alessandro Nivola, breaks down the Ratliff clan’s psychology and where Lochlan goes from here.

Were you a White Lotus fan before getting cast?

I had actually never seen it because I’m just not a TV guy. When I got the audition, I was going to watch one episode, and of course, I was up all night watching both seasons. It’s fucking awesome.

Did you receive the entire script initially? What was your initial impression of Lochlan?

I did get the whole script immediately and I loved it. I try to have a mantra for my characters that I return to. I make it as simple as just one word. For Lochlan, he’s insecure. He’s stuck between childhood and adulthood. It’s the classic story of an adolescent who doesn't yet know his place in the world and is desperately trying to find it.

How did you and the other actors conceptualize the Ratliffs? Have you ever known a family like that?

The Ratliffs are more than just a rich family, they’re a rich Southern family, which is a very specific thing. I'm learning that more now as I'm sitting here in North Carolina, where the Ratliffs are from. To prepare, I read some articles about what Southern life is like. I also spoke to a friend of a friend who goes to UNC, who's a member of one of these big, dynastic, high-powered Chapel Hill families, and what it was like growing up in that environment.

What was the dynamic between you, Patrick Schwarzenegger, and Sarah Catherine Hook?

Patrick was a real older brother to me. He and Sarah Catherine are two of my best friends in the world, I'd say. Some of that was not by choice because we were sandwiched together for seven months without really seeing anyone else. But I also got really lucky in that they're both not only incredibly talented actors who are easy to work with, but they're also funny, charming, sweet, loyal friends. They're the best, and it's rare. So many actors are so difficult.

Piper and Saxon feel like the angel and devil on Lochlan’s shoulders.

I think you’re right. We have such a fascinating dynamic, the three of us, and this came up when I spoke to my North Carolinian pal. In these big, rich families where everyone has their own nanny, dad's at work all the time, and mom's pilled out of her mind, you're not necessarily as close with one another as in a normal family. At face value, it seems like we are caught in this weird close dynamic, but really, the three of us are motivated by ourselves. Saxon and Piper may seem like they're trying to be good older siblings and guide their brother in the right direction, but really, it's about their competitiveness with each other and wanting to feel like they’re justified in their own beliefs about their life.

About the Lochlan and Saxon hook-up scene—what did you think when you first read that?

I knew something weird was going to happen, but I didn't necessarily think Mike would take it there. As I kept rereading the script, I realized that it made sense. It’s a very dramatic way of providing a metaphor to explain the relationship between these characters and how it's unhealthy and needs to change.

What did you understand that metaphor to be?

My character is a real people pleaser. He wants everyone around him to be happy and to like him. When Saxon tells him that Chloe likes his magic, that's the biggest smile I give the whole season. The sexual nature of that scene is just a blown-out, big way of saying: I'm trying to please Saxon in any way in order to feel loved in return. Then I go too far, and it totally backfires, and he wants nothing to do with me. It’s really sort of tragic.

There’s been speculation online all season about whether either Saxon or Lochlan is in the closet, but the dynamic between them seems deeper than that.

I definitely don’t think Saxon is in the closet. He is what he appears to be. He loves women, and by the end of the season, I think he learns to love women in a way that is a little bit less objectifying. For Lochlan, I don't think that's the debate happening in his head. There's an aspect to him that's sort of asexual. Going back to that scene, it's not even about the sex itself. He's got so many other things about growing up to do first that take precedence over figuring that out.

Without giving too much away, where do Lochlan and Saxon go from here?

Before I got to Thailand, I had a really interesting conversation with Mike. I asked him about the White Lotus pattern, where every character has an arc, and the hotel changes them, for better or for worse, and how that applies to my character. He was like, it's way more complicated than that. A lot of the time, people will never change and will be stuck in their ways forever. That's sort of where Lochlan ends up. You’d think that, as the youngest person on the show, Lochlan would wind up learning something about himself or discovering something new, changing his actions. But I really don't think he does.